How did Silicon Cape miss this?!
<rant>
I’ve been holding some feelings back for quite some time now about Silicon Cape and as much as I feel like blasting the initiative for many reasons, I think I’ll leave them aside for now and hope to see some things change.
My gripe this evening though is that Silicon Cape burst into popularity across Cape Town and caught the attention of many other cities, and basically attempted to position itself as the leading technology hub in South Africa. Being at such a position, one would think that they have depth with their reach and that they would have grasped onto one of the biggest things South Africa’s online world has ever faced – FNB and PayPal coming together.
This afternoon I received an invitation from FNB to attend an event in the upcoming weeks where Michael Jordan, CEO of FNB, and senior executives from PayPal will be discussing how they’re working together to make global eCommerce faster and easier for the South African market.
Naturally, I jumped with joy at the invite, I do feel I should be there as iMod.co.za has played a role in speeding up this entire process, but then something dawned on me – It’s in johannesburg!!! I honestly couldn’t believe it, Cape Town’s like meant to be Silicon Cape and stuff isn’t it, the center place, the tech place?
Anyway, I was told that I would be flown up for the conference, which was really appreciated, the problem isn’t that, it’s that I don’t have the time to fly around at the moment.
I really don’t want to be a sour grape about this, but I’d be lying if I didn’t say that I am incredibly bleak/upset/let down (call it what you will) that the Silicon Cape Initiative didn’t manage to bag this; and I guess my biggest concern is that Silicon Cape has a focus on money (oh, I’m so phrasing this kindly), so you’d imagine FNB and PayPal would be right up their alley.
</rant>
PS. I have been told that there’s going to be an event in Cape Town, but to be honest, if you don’t attend the first one, it’s not really the same.
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Christopher is the founder of iMod - Most of his time is spent building websites and pushing the limits with Search Engine Optimization. You can follow him on Twitter @ChristopherM
Chris M has written: 4759 posts.
Mar 11th, 2010 at 7:41 pm
You’re grumpy?! I broke the news on South Africa’s largest financial news site, regularly chat to senior FNB execs and they didn’t even send me an invite… COLD!
Fortunately I get to hear about it from the odd blogger here and there.
;-)
Johannesburg rocks, Cape Town a little too sleepy. Except of course their mighty mighty rugby team!
Mar 11th, 2010 at 7:43 pm
PS I’ve been writing nice things about FNB all week and how innovative they are and this is what I get for my efforts. I’m gonna gatecrash – the lunch had better be good.
Mar 11th, 2010 at 7:51 pm
I have no problem with FNB or anyone really, I’m just let down that we have an initiative like Silicon Cape backed by big money and with aims of making big money through venture capital routes, yet they missed this and it’s happening in Jozzie. Nothing against Jozzie, but it’s not Cape Town, which has been screaming about being the Tech capital of SA.
Mar 11th, 2010 at 7:53 pm
Not sure I fully understand what Silicon Cape has to do with where PayPal / FNB choose to hold their events.
Mar 11th, 2010 at 7:59 pm
OMG!!! It was you Marc?
Awesome man! You completely rock! :) I am so thankful for that tidbit of info. It gave me hope again :) Big up to you dude!
Mar 11th, 2010 at 8:10 pm
Chris,
Firstly, FNB and PayPal are extremely large organisations so I can bet a large sum of money that the confidentiality agreements between the two companies during this process where very tight. There were obviously several and quite large hurdles they both needed face in order to bring PayPal to South Africa.
Secondly, the guys behind the SiliconCape and now the official Steering Committee are regular guys, with regular jobs. I will also bet you that they have a very large to-do list, especially since taking their new positions having to deal with the hand overs and catch-up in all areas that the interim steering committee made progress in.
Thirdly, the SiliconCape initiative is meant to be own by the people themselves. You’re in Cape Town, you seem to be connected enough and based on many of your blog posts, PayPal is a high ranking concern of yours. Why didn’t you try and touch base with FNB or PayPal and assist them in making this launch even bigger off the back of the SiliconCape hype / brand?
Fourthly, FNB and PayPal are massive as I said above. Their priority is just getting this out to the public as soon as possible. They might have unfortunately forgotten / missed all the SiliconCape hype, while focusing on the priorities at hand. Big companies can mess up a little too.
Fifthly, Jo’Burg rocks too dude! We have just as many start-ups as Cape Town. We just tend not to circle jerk too much! I dig Cape Town, no need to hate on us!
Sixthly, I like you, I consider you a friend. It’s the only reason I posted this comment, just to upset you even more! :P
Mar 11th, 2010 at 8:32 pm
JHB rocks dude!
Mar 11th, 2010 at 8:40 pm
FNB are doing an unbelievably shitty job of launching this product, their whole attitude has been peculiar to say the least. When it was leaked (on Moneyweb actually), they kinda sorta admitted it, and instead of trumpeting it to the rooftops, they’ve been ludicrously coy and secretive. I’m so glad you guys are invited to the launch, maybe you can induce them to share this wondrous secret with the punters who are hoping to use it.
Mar 11th, 2010 at 8:51 pm
No… you will find that on the 7th of Feb John Edwards wrote on Moneyweb that PayPal would be a nice to have.
On the 10th of Feb Nicola Mawson wrote a confirmation for Moneyweb.
At 9:24 on Monday the 8th of Feb Fin24.com http://www.fin24.com/articles/default/display_article.aspx?ArticleId=1518-24_2570955
Maybe a little bit of professional jealousy but suffice to say we broke the story first.
Although to be fair – certain people leaked it on Twitter the Sunday before.
And the reason they are doing a “shitty” job is because certain people inside their camp jumped the gun a long time before any formal agreements had been reached. Once they saw the positive response it generated they realised they were onto a good thing but didn’t have anything to back it up with in terms of knowing whether they even have Reserve Bank permission.
Mar 11th, 2010 at 9:02 pm
We’ve been invited too and our Joburg Zoopy TV content team will be covering this. So it’s not first prize for CT but you can embed it as soon as it’s live and everyone wins :)
Mar 11th, 2010 at 9:12 pm
If you can’t come to Jozi, send me your invite :-)
Heheh
Mar 11th, 2010 at 9:26 pm
Chris:
What is your measure of success of an initiative like the Silicon Cape?
I’m a bit surprised that someone would feel that getting FNB/Paypal to launch their initiative to the public in a particular area is such a high priority.
Personally, I think we have far more important things to deal with (including getting PayPal here at all), so I can’t say that I see how this could or should be an issue at all.
Having been fairly closely involved in some of the start-up matters, I’d be very surprised if many of the committee members were at all concerned about something like this. Several of them don’t even live in the Cape – and to my understanding, while the “Silicon Cape” provides a good branding opportunity and geographic cluster focus, it is very much open season to everyone who wants to get involved, be they in Jozi, Bloem or Mtunzini.
It seems a rather parochial attitude to dismiss the initiative because of a chosen geographic focus, given that any changes in national situation would impact everyone within this country (and when it comes to Exchange Control, the entire Common Monetary Area, i.e. Lesotho and Swaziland, and Namibia too given its exchange control agreements with ZA.)
PS: I’m also not sure as to whether you would have realised this, but what you have presented certainly could be interpreted as “sour grapes” – a cheap shot at an irrelevant issue sparked partly by your acknowledged discomfort with the initiative. *shrug*
Mar 11th, 2010 at 9:30 pm
–quote–
[The Silicon Cape]…basically attempted to position itself as the leading technology hub in South Africa.
–end quote–
As far as I know, it’s more an attempt to position the Cape and South Africa as **a** leading technology presence in the world. I’m not sure whether there was a slip of tense there, because as was stated at the launch event, on the website and the video interviews, this is a 20+ year project and very much aligned to preparing in advance to changing economic structure for a future post-resource economy.
Mar 11th, 2010 at 10:00 pm
@Tyler – Apart from displaying that you can count to 6 (muahhaa, I had to), you raise some valid points, which I can appreciate. I do agree that both FNB and PayPal are large companies and that a huge amount of money and planning took place. I do feel though, that the destination of Jozzie was not their choice, but more a location based on influence, that’s just my opinion, again, and naturally their aim is getting the information out there rather than carefully selecting a destination to keep me happy ;)
You are right about the new steering committee being incredibly busy, I won’t take that away from them at all! I tried various steps to get more involved directly with FNB mate, and I tried with PayPal, it would seem that I was “noticed”, which is super, but perhaps not noticed enough; never-the-less, I am a single entity, and an employee, I don’t have the time to try muster up a team of people to try and squeeze into a “circle-jerk” scenario. Perhaps I could have done a little more, I don’t deny that, but I voted for people to be on the steering committee because I felt they would do a good job, which I still believe they will, I just feel upset that of all things, this was one that they could have grabbed onto and brought to Cape Town. I have nothing against Jozzie, the few times I’ve been there I’ve thoroughly enjoyed it and I know a ton of people there, including yourself, who I think are great and who I consider friends – the issue was never with Jozzie specifically, it could have been any town for that matter and I would have felt the same.
I also feel that if Silicon Cape was involved, it would have been a “people’s initiative”, after all, that’s what Silicon Cape is all about and at the moment, I feel that one company has carefully positioned itself here and I’m very against this sort of thing, I’m all for a global village, everyone helping eachother out – I think our small click of peeps in CPT and JHB on Twitter and the likes is awesome, being part of it rocks, we should keep these things more open.
I hope I’ve explained myself clearly here, it’s tricky when shit causers come along and stir ;)
@possum – I wouldn’t say they’re doing a terrible job, I mean, this is highly sensitive stuff and they know how the public is sitting and waiting to jump on, they need to do things incredibly carefully in order to keep us happy, otherwise they land up with blog posts like this one ;)
@Jason – Ye mate, that’s definitely a good second prize and I’ll definitely want to watch it and embed it for my readers – thank you.
@Haroun – I don’t think it’s as easy as that.
@Andrew – The thing here is that I feel that Silicon Cape did a good job of creating a great foundation or incubation hub, if I may, and carefully placing a huge movement like this into the right incubator could result in more people playing a roll, or at least more people being aware of it and having access to the information at similiar times to the “big fish”, rather than having the big fish deciding what information to share – Remember, that’s what fuels this online media – the easy access to information, real information, not carefully phrased and selected information. Andrew, I’m not totally dismissing the whole thing at all, I want to learn more, I want to use PayPal and I want to provide my readers with the information, I’ve spent days carefully following the PayPal situation, there is no ways I’m writing it off! As far as a “cheap shot” goes, please now, have some respect for me, if you know anything about me, you’ll know that’s not how I role mate – The last thing I want is a flame war, been there, done that, got the blog awards.
Mar 11th, 2010 at 10:12 pm
FNB’s head office is in JHB, it’s really got nothing to do with Silicon Cape.
Just fly up for the day, Chris. I’m sure you can take one day off for something as important as this.
Mar 11th, 2010 at 10:24 pm
@Richard – That’s a good point, I wasn’t aware that their head offices were there, guess I could have guessed that. Never-the-less, I still maintain that this is really something that Silicon Cape should have pulled out all stops to be involved with. I’m going to wait for the Cape Town gathering and see what happens there, otherwise I’ll take Jason Elk up on his offer to provide me with footage from the Jozzie one. I’m surprised you wrote off this discussion so easily Richard, you normally like to argue for these things.
Mar 11th, 2010 at 10:58 pm
@Chris: PayPal needed a banking partner not a technology partner to operate a full service here.
I don’t think Cape Town is the centre of finance, Joburg is the City of Gold. In many ways, Cape Town acts like a city of sleepy retirees who aren’t even aware that PayPal exists.
I’m pretty sure, if you polled 100 random local people wandering around at Cavendish Square or the V&A Waterfront or Canal Walk and asked them some simple questions about PayPal, they wouldn’t have a clue what you’re talking about.
Here’s 3 sample questions, if you want to conduct your own informal poll:
1. Do you know the online service called PayPal?
2. Have you ever used it?
3. Are you pleased that FNB and PayPal are partnering to offer a full service to South Africans?
I’m betting that over 90 out of 100 random people wandering a Cape Town major mall would not have even heard the word “PayPal”.
It’s sad, but our people are like Stone Age monkeys when it comes to using the Internet.
In a major US city, one would expect 60+% of people polled to have and use a PayPal account.
Internet penetration in SA is low – (around 10%). In the US, it is around 80%.
However, when South Africa finally plucks its head out of its arsehole and delivers cheap fast Internet, that picture will change.
The SA government is the biggest problem. They have allowed Telkom to retain a monopoly on the Local Loop.
By the time they get around to deregulating that and allowing local operators to lay cable, they might as well run fibre to each home and offer an access speed of 1Gbps to the local network. It’s pointless investing in laying more copper cable when the future Internet is going to need to be massively faster than it is today.
Mar 11th, 2010 at 11:07 pm
Hi Richard, you raise a good point, one that I can’t argue with. Although I think highly of Cape Town, I do have to agree that Jozzie is the place where things operate faster and money is far more “important”. So, you think it’s a good thing that they’re doing the conference in Jozzie, good thing in terms of exposure and the number of people who will use it? It’s a good point you make. The though of asking people about PayPal and FNB at a Cape Town shopping center scares the hell out of me, I’d rather carry on pretending that Cape Tonians would understand ;)
Thanks for your comment pal!
Mar 12th, 2010 at 12:57 am
I would actually love to hear some sincere feelings about the whole SC thing, you are the first to publicly hint at disappointment that Ive read but many have SAID as much. As usual in this industry ppl are too worried that they might need someone they offend so they only titter and bitch quietly amongst themselves
This is SUPPOSED to be a community thing, if ppl aren’t happy they should speak up.
Mar 12th, 2010 at 12:58 am
@Wendy – Agreed. I am guilty of being scared about expressing my full opinion around SC; I’d consider myself a bright chap, I read between the lines easily and there’s smoke and mirrors going on around Silicon Cape..
Mar 12th, 2010 at 1:08 am
At least you’ve said something.. I haven’t been following the whole SC thing much but would like to hear honesty when I DO read about them, bit tired of the circle jerk that is CT online sometimes ;)
Mar 12th, 2010 at 1:09 am
Hehe, I’ll rethink about what I wanted to write about wrt to SC, but need to make sure I’m certain that I want to post, because I’ll be FLAMED by the circle jerking!
Mar 12th, 2010 at 1:15 am
It’s always a risk :) and while there are one or two big empty names on the panel there are also some good guys who i would like to think we can trust
and who i wouldn’t like to speak ill of without facts
Mar 12th, 2010 at 1:16 am
Agreed, the peeps I voted for all made it onto the panel and all of them are people who will do things correctly, so I’m hoping they’ll shine through. My biggest concern is that SC is about money, it’s a clever foundation with a great front for something much bigger that lies below..
Mar 12th, 2010 at 1:26 am
I guess this falls under their 2nd objective listed on http://www.siliconcape.com/page/vision-objectives: “Brand and promote the region locally and internationally as the emerging “Silicon Valley of Africa”, a global tech innovation hub” … not sure how much of this they’re actually doing as far as communicating with international companies & major corporates is concerned…
Mar 12th, 2010 at 1:28 am
Ye Eric, one thing though, Tyler raised a good point, the steering committee is very new and all of them work full time jobs, so it will take some time for them to get going, but the problem here is that in such as fast paced industry, there isn’t much time to waste..
Mar 12th, 2010 at 1:58 am
@Chris: FNB will probably get more interest for their PayPal partnership up in JHB than down here.
I’m not going to split hairs about where FNB does the announcement. I think if they’ve offered to fly you up to attend, you should go. It’s a very generous offer of theirs, to pay for your flights.
Go live the jetset lifestyle. :)
I really would like to know how it’s going to work, whether people will need to open an FNB account and whether the fees we will be charged will be in line with other countries. I think this is a great opportunity for you to take questions from your readers, and then get answers at the conference.
This is good news for us, but could be bad news for a lot of local operators, such as payfast.co.za. However, payfast may still be able to remain relevant by accepting PayPal as a payment option.
Mar 12th, 2010 at 2:57 am
SC = they there for the money not for the initiative.
but ur right to be pissed off Chris
many people have been working to make cpt this hub for tech/digital work and we work fucking hard to bring big business to cpt.
this is big, they should have fought for it cos at the end of the day with paypal coming to SA… who is going to really punt it? tech companies. Sure there are firms in JHB but if SC is going to be doing anything it should be bringing focus of big projects/business to CPT…and not on the people behind its ventures.
I just think its shown that their hearts aren’t in it. and if thats the case, they should hand over the reins to people who care and go and sit on a board somewhere and negotiate yearly payouts.
Mar 12th, 2010 at 3:20 am
1. Its a public front to harvest marketing for venture capital firms.
2. All the Sponsors, excl 2 are there for financial reasns.
3. A steering commitee was appointd for public acceptance – strategic move.
4. Its another circle jerking initiativ where the same folks take the lead.
5. Its not about the iniative or the people.
Mar 12th, 2010 at 3:21 am
Peeps, let’s please try keep this on topic, I didn’t want to open up a forum for flaming :)
Mar 12th, 2010 at 7:46 am
I agree with Richard Go for get on that plane and attend. You will then have first hand experience to share with your subscribers
Mar 12th, 2010 at 7:47 am
I think there’s an adage here about involving a horse, a gift, a mouth and looking at something. Simply put, if someone wanted to give me a free flight to some event: I’d hit that. I’m delaying my plans to come to Cape Town for a few hours just so I can go to the Paypal launch.
The point of the matter is that Silicon Cape (unlike most people that have recently commented) is a good initiative but they keep telling us that it’s not just about Cape Town and our Joburg entrepreneurs are being accepted with open arms as it’s merely a two hour flight away. Surely the converse works here? How many tech entrepreneurs do you know that fly between the two cities weekly? I know a few.
Secondly, you’ve probably got an hourly rate which we can assume FNB and Paypal CEO’s have as well. If you consider how much you’d be costed out for the time of event and four hours of flying it would probably not equate to how much an FNB CEO is worth an hour. The logistics here are simple: Their time is literally worth more than yours.
Take the ticket, work on the plane and come join us in Jozi for the launch. I’ll be there, we’ll have a fun time :)
Mar 12th, 2010 at 8:10 am
Hey Chris,
Being based in Durban, we hardly get to see these types of things come our way, mostly cause of the lack of interest by the people in Durban, and I suppose the market we have here.
We have to remember, Paypal & FNB is not a Jozi initiative, or a “Silicon Cape” initiative, it is a South African initiative, and while I agree with Catto, that not many people in South Africa are not going to know this “Paypal thing” is, it’s a step in the right direction.
I also think that by simply being invited to the event, you have been noticed, and is an opportunity that cannot be missed.
I was also invited, and am making every effort I can to get to the launch. It is a BIG BIG day in South African online history, that we can all be proud of ;)
Mar 12th, 2010 at 9:20 am
@ChrisM:
Thanks for taking the time to reply.
Re: the “cheap shot”, you said:
–snip–
As far as a “cheap shot” goes, please now, have some respect for me, if you know anything about me, you’ll know that’s not how I role mate – The last thing I want is a flame war, been there, done that, got the blog awards.
–snip–
You’ll notice I said that you what you had written “could” be interpreted that way. I don’t know you and unfortunately neither do many of the people who will read this material, which is why I thought it potentially important to point the above out to you. (You’ll also notice I didn’t *conclude* that you had intended it that way – I very much prefer giving people the opportunity to expand and give more background.)
I’m very much interested in what your perceptions of the information dissemination to date and how you think things have been split “big fish” vs others in any way.
@Wendy: It’s important that people’s voices be heard and that opinions are expressed. It’s also important to do it in a manner that doesn’t degenerate into non-productive flame wars. I’m pretty strongly pro the SC movement, having been involved from months prior to the launch, and I’m available and willing to discuss what *I* (as a “member”, not the committee, or anything else) see as the driving forces, vision and achieved objectives to date.
@Marc: the sponsorship and a lot of the drive behind the initiative wouldn’t have happened without an alignment of both financial and philanthropic interests. It makes financial sense for the VC’s sponsoring to support the initiative.
This doesn’t detract from the ultimate long-term vision that the initiative supports: an *ecosystem* of tech start-ups. Only short-sighted investors, sponsors, et al would try to milk the SC initiative for immediate VC leads. Simply put, there aren’t many, so anything done to try generate these leads will have to take into account the local context and the required changes and development.
Even if VC’s were to drive the creation of a Silicon Valley (historically inaccurate), a Boston hub (historically inaccurate) or an Israeli hub, which hubs proved to be ultimately successful (in financial terms), do you believe that all (or even most) of the rewards accrued to those VC’s?
Lastly, to all those who believe that the SC committee members should have fought to have the PayPal/FNB launch in Cape Town – why do you believe these individuals had the knowledge about this happening so far ahead of the individual SC members or the general public? (And importantly, how do you think they *CAN* be aware of these things so much further ahead so as to be able to influence these things in future?)
Mar 12th, 2010 at 9:32 am
The FNB/PayPal launch is great news for the SA Web generally – wherever it’s launched. What some of the Silicon Cape steering committee members are working towards is to ensure that more such breakthroughs happen. For this, we need supportive policy, and a welcoming context.
I think you raise an excellent point about Silicon Cape working to get more launches in Cape Town.
I think hearty dialogue (even criticism) about Silicon Cape can only be a good thing. It ensures that the movement really is democratic and driven by the needs and wants of the people in the web industry.
Rock on, Chris.
Mar 12th, 2010 at 10:14 am
You’ve gotta feel for FNB as well. There are in a catch 22 here because if they use JHB first then CT people are upset and if they CT first then JHB people are upset.
Try see this from a business point of view as well, SC is still very very very very very new in business terms. Although it’ll probably be a huge force to be reckoned with in years …
Mar 12th, 2010 at 10:15 am
This is not my space, so SC was a new discovery. Disappointing to see that their vision spends a third of its time saying why it CAN’T suceed, which may indicate mindset, and hence may be affecting your view of them. Perhaps this alludes to underlying motivations and mindsets. I hope it works in time if just to find and grow one more – or the next – Chris Mills person. As we all know, there is plenty of SA talent waiting to take the world by storm.
Mar 12th, 2010 at 10:16 am
I must disagree Christopher, all I see of SC is that they CAN do anything and everything. This is the first piece of “negative” press I’ve personally seen and at that, its more of a “we should’ve tried harder” than “we failed and cant do it”.
Mar 12th, 2010 at 10:38 am
@Christopher wrote:
–quote–
Disappointing to see that their vision spends a third of its time saying why it CAN’T suceed, which may indicate mindset, and hence may be affecting your view of them.
–end quote–
Could you please provide context? (References or sourced cut-n-paste that shows what you are referring to above would be helpful.)
Thanks. A
Mar 12th, 2010 at 10:41 am
@Andrew – “I don’t know you and unfortunately neither do many of the people who will read this material”
Funny you say this, because you’ll *actually* find that 90% of people interested in this topic *will* know me. 8 of the 11 steering committee members know me and there’s a chance the final 3 might know of me. This is the very reason why I can write a blog post like this and not get completely flamed, I have spent years earning the respect to be able to raise such topics.
As a numbers guy and analyst, I don’t expect you to know all the web junkies in Cape Town or South Africa, I am sure there is someone in the team who handles that part, so I don’t want to get into a fight about who’s who here, because I don’t think it’s important. What I do think is important is that you respect me for my concerns, which you seem to after mentioning that you’re interested in my “perceptions of the information dissemination to date and how you think things have been split “big fish” vs others in any way”.
My point here was that if Silicon Cape had been more involved in this movement between FNB and PayPal then we would be CUTTING OUT the “big fish” situation, reread what I wrote and you’ll see that I’m actually backing Silicon Cape saying that the initiative would have been the best organisation to be involved in terms of giving the people of South Africa easy access to the information :) And, this is why I am upset that SC didn’t get more involved – make sense?
Mar 12th, 2010 at 12:06 pm
@ChrisM:
I can see how you could be right about 90% of your readers knowing you and who you are. Perhaps I am over-cautious in my concerns.
Still, it seems sad that you believe (and I acknowledge the likely truth of this) that you need to build a “reputation” before you can state your opinions before getting flamed into the ground. As an outsider, that seems to say something rather negative for the community culture. (Also contributing to this is a concern that you express that this might deteriorate into a “who’s who in the zoo” debate :/ )
To your point, I still want to know *HOW* the SC guys could have been more involved in the movement between FNB and Paypal, as a practical matter. What specific actions do you wish the SC committee members would have taken, given their individual situations? Do you believe that people should have tried to make contact with FNB or Paypal directly, themselves? Do you believe these companies would have disclosed more material to the SC guys? (Perhaps that these matters were likely covered by a non-disclosure or confidentiality agreement only seems natural to me because of my background.)
(And as to whether I would take your opinions seriously: I don’t need to know you that well to take your statements and their content seriously. I’m taking time to try to understand, given my personal background, what exactly your expectations were that were not met and therefore what could be learned from this and how people could do things differently next time round. It’s the last part I’m still struggling with.)
Mar 12th, 2010 at 12:24 pm
@Andrew – It’s not 90% of my readers, it’s 90% of people who would be interested in this specific post, 100% of my readers know me :P~ *duh*
That’s a common problem in the web zoo mate, anyone who’s been around for a while knows that reputation is incredibly important and there’s a HUGE amount of “it’s who you know” here. That’s why this topic is hard for us to discuss, because I’m talking very much about the inner-circles and clicks here. Anyway.
Well, I see the team at SC being very dynamic, youngsters who are incredibly wealthy and very connected and then more educated and worldly members, what I mean is that the team is well rounded and there’s no chance that most of them were blind to the whole idea of PayPal coming to South Africa via FNB. That being said, I would have imagined that because a lot of the members have strong financial focuses and others strong web focuses, that they would have managed to touch sides with PayPal or FNB. Most of the members know Andy Hadfield, who works at FNB (if I’m not mistaken) and that would have been a good in road. You might ask now why I didn’t, well, I have a full time job amongst other things and I honestly don’t have the time and that’s why I never pushed to be on the steering committee and that’s why I voted and spread the word, so that the right people could get in there – if they don’t have time, then they should rather leave it for someone who does have time. Anyway, back on topic, a collective of people who launched, what was said to be, a very good initiative would have far more power/reach to touch sides the right people.
Does that make sense?
Now let me ask a question – Why did SC not get more involved? Or, did they, but they got denied?
Mar 12th, 2010 at 2:02 pm
With reference to your query/comment Stephen/Andrew at 10:16 and 10:38, here is the link to their vision – I specifically refer to the lower 3rd half regarding what needs to change. http://www.siliconcape.com/page/vision-objectives see regulatory obstacles.
If you search “obstacles” in their search panel, nothing found, so, I ponder why a vision that makes heavy reference to obstacles, but does not have any reference I could easily find, showing how they are planning to overcome and engage the authorities/role players.
Mar 12th, 2010 at 2:09 pm
Good point Christopher, I didn’t actually think of that :)
Mar 13th, 2010 at 4:50 pm
I wrote some stuff on the subject and a number of paid vested interested flamed me considerably, granted certain parties in that initiative do false PR for web for a living.
It was all a publicity stunt to benefit its founder and his 2 lackies. Thankfully a famous politician picked them apart in the news later. They got their just deserved trouncing.
Not to mention trying to launch the next Internet hub in a country who is rated not only the worst but most expensive in the world, is like trying to hold pedophile anonymous meetings in the middle of a children’s school during lunch break.
Mar 13th, 2010 at 9:06 pm
@Craig:
Details, please?
What did you write and where did you publish it? Who flamed you?
Which “founder”? (I was under the impression that there were at least two.) Who are his lackies?
Who is the famous politician? What did he/she pick apart?
Please, try http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Avoid_weasel_words
I don’t believe that South Africa’s Internet is the worst or most expensive. Try Niger, Tajikistan, Republic of Congo or French Guiana.
If you’re going to make statements like these, please back them up.
Mar 13th, 2010 at 9:10 pm
@ChrisM:
I think I get what you’re getting at with your questions. You asked “Why did SC not get more involved? Or, did they, but they got denied?”
I don’t think that they did get involved. I also happen to be of the opinion that this getting a launch event for something like this isn’t worth the effort. I believe that we have bigger fish to fry, like actually trying to get change the environment itself (legal or otherwise), rather than talking about it post-event when that change does occur.
I’m quite happy and comfortable to accept that you believe differently and appreciate you having taken the time to interact with me and help me understand better from where you were coming. Thanks.
Mar 13th, 2010 at 11:33 pm
“bigger fish to fry”, such as?
During the first Silicon Cape “seminar”, one of the biggest points that was spoken about was the whole PayPal situation, I would imagine that PayPal was a big fish..
Mar 13th, 2010 at 11:47 pm
@Chris M:
To be clear (and to avoid a potential strawman argument), I am referring to the *LOCATION OF THE PUBLICITY LAUNCH* of the PayPal initiative. It is my *opinion* that where this launch happens to occur is small fry by comparison to whether or not PayPal is available in this country, whether SA organisations are permitted to open credit card merchant accounts that charge in foreign currency (Dollars, Euros), whether angel funds can be set up without requiring FSB registration, etc, etc.
Don’t confuse the issue of PayPal availability to ZA-based businesses (big fish IMO) with the geographic location of a press launch.
Mar 13th, 2010 at 11:47 pm
@Andrew.
Brother, while I agree with your comments re Craigs use of words and innuendo, please refrain form mentioning the counties you do, lest we want to be associated with them. Do we? now really.
While you may feel close to the SC cause – and i respect your position, can we debate the merits of the case at hand rather?
Chris raised the point od SC not really doing much, and I have yet to see anyone from SC come here and argue the opposite, with facts of actions, activities, concrete plans, etc etc etc. Could you perhaps get the powers that be to enter the fray on bealf of their cause?
Really look forward to seeing substance in this debate or alas, it’ll frizzle out as do the newspaper headlines far too often. This should not be a case of who shouts loudest, but a real discussion of merit.
I think we are all mature enough to balance opinions with fact and then make up our minds.
Come on gang, raise the bar please. I’m really tired of the excess of hot air in our society (the direction in which this discussion is sadly headed), and hope we can start a ………. trend. Dare I say that? Make fact and truth viable options? Make masitakes? Ar ewe allowed to? do we have permission to say things based on a view of fac tthat is ….diffferent? Gasp. Imagine. Breathtaking.
The day we realise that we are all fallible, all human, yet all possess the potential to make massive changes around us, the better for all.
Mar 14th, 2010 at 7:28 am
I sit on two sides of this debate and had part of this discussion two weeks ago with Andrew.
As a journalist
I’ve interviewed some of the people involved in the whole SC thing and some of the entrepreneurs who have gotten some good exposure out of it.
My comment to Andrew at the time was that while SC might be doing things beneath the radar, it’s still has to be seen to be visible. At the time I said that in my opinion much of the energy and momentum (from a press perspective) had fizzled out and the SC steering committee had to be seen to be “doing” stuff.
As a tech investor / entrepreneur
I was always taught never to throw a stone and criticise unless you’re prepared to muck in and do something about it. As some of you know, a couple of us (incl. Andrew) gave up some time to brainstorm around an SC hub in Gauteng which could be a nice way to engage role players including I guess if they were interested FNB and Nedbank who are trying to co-ordinate the launch of PayPal and another system).
I have a meeting with Michael Jordaan (FNB CEO) on the 25th. I’ll point out that you guys in CT feel left out and could his peeps co-ordinate more closely with the SC steering committee. They are desperate for initiatives to engage SME’s and entrepreneurs.
Secondly Chris M’s post criticises the fact that SC “missed” out on PayPal but we quickly forget that SC kicked off with multi-million rand investment in two promising SA start-ups and in many ways was a catalyst for Eve’s Crowd Fund which has
A) Raised a potential R750k in funding for start-ups that definately wasn’t going to come out of the banks
B) Has fundamentally changed the way that start-ups seek venture capital in South Africa
In my humble conclusion: Yes SC could do a bit more to up its public profile, but the flip side of that is that Justin and co are at 11 in the evening trying to engage journalists to try and highlight some of the challenges they face as investors which has a knock-on effect to all involved.
Mar 14th, 2010 at 7:46 am
@Marc – What 2 promising start-ups were they? Eve’s crowd fund did well because it was a great idea and because people wanted to support (For the record though, no money has been raised yet from what I can tell, it’s merely a projected value of R750,000.00), I somehow don’t see SC having a roll in that, please feel free to prove me incorrect. Once again, it all boils down to money, I’m seeing money, money, money and no passion (except passion to make money) and that’s what the problem is; Yes, we all need to eat, but that’s why everyone involved has a full time job, as well. I am still giving SC the benefit of the doubt and am optimistic about their movements, I’d just like to see more open-ness towards the public and less about freaking money/investments/capital/venture..
Mar 14th, 2010 at 8:14 am
On CrowdFund: Yip that’s why I very clearly said a “potential” R750k. Briefly on this – if it hadn’t been for the SC community and the “buzz” that had been created around it I wouldn’t have known who she is, I wouldn’t have pledged any cash to it nor would I have written about it on South Africa’s biggest financial news site or why it was picked up by CNBC etc.
Potentially 500000 investors, innovators etc can read about her because there is to coin that cheesy phrase: “an enabling environment”. She had maybe R300k before it hit the mainstream media. Hers won’t be the last fund of this nature and every innovator, wanna be techie etc is going to be given a chance to get their business idea off the ground.
On the money issue – why are we berating people for being passionate about starting businesses that are going to (hopefully) make money?
Would you be as passionate or put as much effort into your blogs if you weren’t making anything out of them? You add value to a community and make some dosh out of it.
I’m passionate about my businesses but it is easier to be passionate when there is money coming in.
I’m pretty sure that all the investors who are promoting SC as an initiative are equally passionate about seeing a viable start-up culture in South Africa established. They might make a few bucks if decent investments come through.
What’s a global failure rate for start-up tech investments? Call it 75%? So saying that the investors are in it for the money seems a bit harsh??
Whether you like it or not: “freaking money/investments/capital/venture” are tied in with the passion, the job creation, the technology and innovation that SC and its members are trying to promote.
Mar 14th, 2010 at 8:53 am
And sorry something else which just jumped out at me which ties back to the Crowd Fund. Up top you have a link to a post you wrote on AngelMoola which was (to the best of my knowledge) South Africas first real step toward an online social lending platform.
Business model aside (because it was never really given a chance I think because it was before its time), the thing which killed it was a regulatory environment which did not and probably still doesn’t support social, angel and venture cap lending in SA.
Two short years later those changes are now being investigated by people with vested interests. Whether they are the SC community, SAVCA, entrepreneurs like Eve etc. changes are being made.
Ditto around things like PayPal where enough people are making a noise about it.
Mar 14th, 2010 at 12:11 pm
Hey Marc,
Totally understand what you’re saying; I still reckon it was the general buzz on blogs and twitter that fueled crowdfund :)
Look, I’m not saying that anything should be done for free, time is money, I understand that just as much as you or any other business person does, what I’m saying is that I don’t think that should be the focus, which it seems to be at the moment – I am not just speaking personally here, I have asked a huge number of people who also follow Silicon Cape. What I want to start seeing is how it’s going to help all of us – By “us”, I am not referring to the circle-jerking crowd, but rather the average person who uses the Internet as a means of entrepreneurship. Naturally, SC, raised a lot of attention and awareness about Cape Town, and obviously South Africa, which I think is wonderful, but the hype died down dead quickly and people detached and that’s why I raised the whole PayPal situation, because that’s something that’s going to get people of South Africa onto a new level and it would have been the perfect opportunity for SC to not only create even more awareness, but I feel it would have help with their money situation to some degree.
As I’ve said, I am not against SC, I would be an idiot to be against such as initiative, I just think that the focus is slightly off what is best for the community in general, and I’m hoping that the new steering committee is going to change this, and I’m confident that they will :)
Mar 16th, 2010 at 1:30 pm
Smacks of sour grapes.
Mar 23rd, 2010 at 11:35 am
Chris,
You are smart and a good writer AND you have received an invitation to an event that I regard as one of the landmarks events that is going to change our online world.
I believe that the sceptical and suspicious South African public will start using the web more( which is getting cheaper) for shopping – for buying and selling).
The Silicon issue is something else – deal with that another day.
Please go to Jo’burg and find out what the PayPal/FNB issue is all about. Like Richard I also want to know all the ins and outs and I know you’ll find out all the things we want to know.
Mar 23rd, 2010 at 1:21 pm
Hi Karen,
Thanks for your comment; Don’t worry, I will get the information the minute it’s available, regardless of whether I attend or not :)
Mar 24th, 2010 at 11:51 pm
Speaking entirely as an outsider here – I literally know nobody on the SC committee, and frankly, couldn’t care less about the entire initiative at this point. It’s only been 6 months since the launch, so I’d say, give it some more time before drawing any major conclusions. With that said, though:
I think SC has made a monumental failure here. The single biggest thing in international finance and ecommerce has landed in SA, and it looks as if SiliconCape did absolutely nothing to bring it to CT.
All I’ve read in these comments are excuses. Yes, FNB is headquartered in JHB, but it also has offices in CT. Yes, maybe the launch team on FNB’s side didn’t have time to consider CT as a venue, but then isn’t that sort of lobbying exactly what SC is supposed to do? To bring high-profile events, companies and attention to Cape Town?
I disagree that most people in CT don’t know what PayPal is, but even if you take that view, then HELLO, isn’t this event PERFECT for this purpose, then? For the very Awareness, Promotion and Branding that SC has at the top of its objectives?
They should have fought tooth and nail for this, and when they failed, should have taken the next best option, set up an event anyway, live stream the conference and create a Twitter stream to post questions back to JHB, maybe all sponsored by Mweb’s new uncapped adsl. OR F*CK*NG SOMETHING!
And then there are more excuses from SiliconCape. Yes, you have dayjobs, yes, this is costing you extra, yes, you have to work late, but guess what? Founding this was YOUR choice, YOU’VE made these promises, and now YOU have to deliver. SC can’t rely on people suddenly and automatically seeing CT as the venue of choice, just because we have an Initiative and a Website and Funding – SC needs to FIGHT for it, and you’ve already lost the first battle.
This could have been an immense profile-raiser, and an excellent feather to add to the victory cap, but instead, all we have now is the taste of failure, and blog posts and comments like this one.
SC, you really need to choose your game. If you’re not going to do battle with the corporates like FNB on behalf of us entrepreneurs, then why do you exist? To marshal funding? To what end? How is what you’re doing actually going to improve our “local IP entrepreneurial community”?
Have you gone hunting for undiscovered talent? Have you started iniatives like coding for bounties, design/concept competitions, an entrepreneur-specific social network, subsidizing adsl and mobiles for developing communities, a local job-exchange network, forums and helpcenters for upstart bloggers? Or do you wait for other people to start it first? In that case why do you even exist?
If you’re purely a VC funding network, then say so. And find other people who actually care about fostering local IP, are willing to fight the battles that need to be fought, to actually get in the frigging trenches with the uninspired and create some interest, and people that don’t make excuses when they fail, but simply try harder to succeed.
And this is why I couldn’t care less for the initiative at this point – mostly because it hasn’t taken any. 6 months, 2294 members, and we’re still waiting.
~ Wogan
Mar 25th, 2010 at 11:00 pm
Wogan, what I can tell you is that I’ve had 28 emails about your comment from people backing up exactly what you’ve said, so well done for sharing your thoughts and not being a coward like most of the readers out there who are too scared to voice their opinions.
It takes huge guts to write a post like this and just as much to leave a comment on this post, so to everyone who has stood up, stated their point and left their name, I respect you. To the others, stop being scared, stand up and state your opinion.
Mar 26th, 2010 at 5:34 am
@Dave Exactly right, and I think SC is lucky to have guys like yourself and Justin Hartman etc who do in fact give a shite about the community – and I bet the issue is even harder to deal with from within than it is for those standing outside and judging the whole SC by the selfish agendas and ambivalence of a few
The way people have reacted to this post has said a lot about them
@Wogan – love your work dude – some of your suggestions are bloody good and if SC doesn’t take them on board someone else should